译后记
其实也不算什么译后记。在翻译完前面一篇文章之后,没更多想说的了。 毕竟译文前面也写了很长一段,能憋出来的都写在里面了。开这一篇文章其实是因为前面 准备这篇译文的时候,把整个讨论串的消息都读了一遍,感觉其中有不少精彩的观点和论述, 摘录出来放到这里。
翻译太难,这里就直接放原文,不翻译了。斜体和粗体均为编者所加。和之前一样, 每段后面附上原文链接。后面的中文部分是我的一些想法。
关于抽象层次
I’m not suggesting that Scheme relies on fewer lines of code than C, but rather that it doesn’t really matter in either case. There are numerous abstraction layers at work here from the hardware (memory, cache layers, processor, etc.) through the OS and standard user-level library components up to the individual applications. The beauty of abstraction layers is that when they work right you can ignore everything below the current layer.
By Russ Ross, http://people.csail.mit.edu/gregs/ll1-discuss-archive-html/msg03300.html
有时候会看到一些人说,你用的这个环境/语言/平台把底层都封装起来了,程序员对 一些基本的事情都不了解,或者是没法做一些我想要的操作,这是个错误。但计算机科学 本身就是一层层抽象叠起来的。可能更重要的事情是先弄清楚你要在哪一个抽象层次上 操作,然后再做事情。
关于语言和性能
The fastest language of any of these ought to be hand-coded assembler - why aren’t all the performance-sensitive folk using that? C and C++ occupy a very similar role today that assembler once did. As actual deployed language and compiler technology has improved, there’s less and less reason to write substantial amounts of code in a language that’s designed to mirror the architecture of a CPU. The strongest justification you can give today for C is that it’s portable and highly-tuned across multiple architectures, i.e. the legacy argument. That one, I’ll grant you.
By Anton van Straaten, http://people.csail.mit.edu/gregs/ll1-discuss-archive-html/msg03298.html
不多说了。
关于 lazy evaluation
As for whether Haskell fans consider laziness crucial to a functional language, you might be surprised to find that not all of them do. In particular, Simon Peyton Jones doesn’t seem to find laziness essential (see http://www.research.microsoft.com/~simonpj/papers/haskell-retrospective/index.htm). What he thinks IS essential, as I’ve said, is being “purely functional,” and he argues that the biggest benefit of sticking to laziness was that it forced them to stick to their pure functional guns, even when the going was very tough.
By Matt Hellige, http://people.csail.mit.edu/gregs/ll1-discuss-archive-html/msg03232.html
对于很多 Haskell 人来说,lazy evaluation 都是他们心中函数式编程必要特性的集合中 必须的一个。再考虑到 Haskell 在函数式编程社区里 cult 般的地位,你会看到不少不用 Haskell 的人也认为 lazy evalution 是 fp 所必要的特性(去知乎上就能看到很多)。 但这里告诉我们,Haskell 的创造者(之一)也认为 laziness 并不是函数式编程所必须的。
关于 side effects
> isn’t functional programming just programming without side effects
You can classify functional languages as pure/impure, lazy/eager. You tend to find that the lazy languages (Haskell, Clean, Miranda) are pure, and impure languages (Lisp, Scheme, ML) are eager. There’s no reason you can’t have a pure eager language, but I can’t think of one (anybody?). Impure lazy languages aren’t really feasible, because the laziness means that you can’t predict when side-effects will occur, which is not useful if you use side-effects to perform I/O.
By “Bayley, Alistair”, http://people.csail.mit.edu/gregs/ll1-discuss-archive-html/msg03219.html
十几年前(也快二十年了),pure eager language 还是理论上存在但现实中没有的东西。 但随着 algebraic effect 如火如荼的发展,现在能举出好几个这样的语言了。
关于 first-class functions
> Functional programming is a style, typified by the use of first-class functions, and higher-order functions (functions that take functions as arguments and apply them, and functions that return functions).
There’s another reason that higher-order functions tend to go hand-in-hand with functional languages, and it’s a paradigmatic one. Since functional languages are generally founded on the idea that “everything is a function,” we’d like them to be able to realize this model. The locus classicus for this idea is, of course, lambda calculus, in which one may model any traditional computing construct using only functions, from the Church numerals on up. Naturally, all these functions are higher-order and anonymous. So the natural translation of lambda-calculus ideas to a practical language BEGINS with higher-order anonymous functions, rather than ending there. It is, in fact, the introduction of non-lambda binding constructs and non-functional primitive data that is, in some sense, a perversion…
This is not so different from the object-oriented idea that everything is be an object, or the older “von Neumann idea” that everything is a mutable cell. It’s just that in order for everything to be a function, some of those functions need to be higher-order.
By Matt Hellige, http://people.csail.mit.edu/gregs/ll1-discuss-archive-html/msg03236.html
我自己从来没能回到 lambda calculus 这个本源来考虑 first-class functions 的问题。 是的,在 lambda calculus 里,所有的值都是用函数来表示的,true 和 false 是这样, 自然数也是借由 Church encoding 通过 lambda 表示出来。上面的这个视角很有意思。
关于用 Scheme 来实现语言
Describing it as “a book about how to implement a Scheme in Scheme” rather misses the point. One point being missed is the importance (or lack thereof) of typical language syntaxes. Think of Scheme for this purpose as a simple and consistent way of representing abstract syntax trees for any language. That’s why it has little obvious “syntax” other than parentheses, and how you can do things like express XML natively in Scheme (see e.g. SXML).
When you see a snippet of code in EOPL that’s written in one of the book’s own languages, don’t think of it as Scheme - think of it as the essential semantic core of a language which could have any of a variety of surface syntaxes. The EOPL languages already have some syntax, provided by macros, but this also can be thought of as a kind of core/internal syntax. You could take any of the EOPL languages and use a lexer and parser generator to quite easily create a more traditional syntactic surface, which maps to the exact code in the EOPL book. What you’d end up with would look as much like any traditional language as you want it to (although your semantic core would be better designed). So for the purposes of EOPL, C/C++ and a language’s surface syntax are both distractions.
What I’m describing might sound impractical to the uninitiated - maybe you wouldn’t want to implement a “real” language on top of a Scheme-like core. The only problem with this assumption is it’s completely wrong: there are any number of real languages that do exactly this. Every functional language that can be compiled to a bytecode, including Haskell and various ML varieties, compiles to a bytecode that bears a strong resemblance to Scheme.
Why is that? It’s because Scheme is an expression of some core mathematical ideas about computation: a relatively minimal set of features that provides a complete computational framework. If you’re implementing a functional language, when you get down to its core, below the syntax and the derived semantic features, you’re likely to end up with something that looks a heck of a lot like a Scheme core.
By Anton van Straaten, http://people.csail.mit.edu/gregs/ll1-discuss-archive-html/msg03292.html
用 S-expression 来做 AST,以尽量少的功能同时尽量少的限制来提供丰富的表达能力, 这是 Scheme 的两个财富。上面加粗的句子,在 rnrs 里也可以找到同样的精神:
Programming languages should be designed not by piling feature on top of feature, but by removing the weaknesses and restrictions that make additional features appear necessary.
One more thing…
前面说不知道怎么翻译 “poor man”,@Zhu Aisi 说可以这么翻译:
可以说是一个颇具时代精神的译法了,特意记在这里。